Is a first floor appartment less desirable?

I don't know if there is any stigma, but as a female buyer I can tell you that from a safety concern I avoid anything below the second floor, especially if there is no doorman. Although the city is experiencing the safest streets in years it wasn't always that way, and stuff still happens.

I am a woman and have lived on the 1st floor for 20 years. It is great, never have to speak to my neighbors in the eleavator. From a resale point there are less buyers.

I hated living in my first-floor place in Brooklyn Heights. For whatever reason, people thought that buzzer 1-A was the super or whatever. It was horrible--street noise, all the noise from upstairs, etc. In the end I moved but not before I put an on/off switch on the intercom (so that I could turn it off at night when idiots who locked themselves out thought I was the doorman).

one word- RODENTS

I gutted renovated a first floor apartment with garden views. I love the apartment and views, but the selling process changed my mind about first floor apartment. It took me 13 months and 4 price reduction to sell. At the same time, apartments in much worst conditions sold in the complex at higher prices. Never again will I buy 1st floor apartment. Take at last 25% off the price, and expect a hard time selling.

The problem with first floor appartments are all of the above, plus NOISE!!!!!!
noise from the street, the lobby the elevator.

Anyone with knowledge on this subject, please go a bit more deeply into the "rodent" thing. Is it a maisonette issue with direct access to the street that creates problems? Or do rodents, somehow, come in from lobby entrance? Doesn't all this depend on quality of the building maint. and (to lesser extent) the neighborhood? Any further insight deeply appreciated!

I never had a rodent problem living on the first floor. I did have a waterbug problem, which were coming from the tub drain. Yes, it depends on the building/neighborhood.

I would stay away from a first floor apartment. In NYC vitually every city (yes even nice, well maintained ones) have to deal with pests. I never had a problem until I lived in a first floor apartment. Rodents can come in through very small cracks. You would be amazed.... Other problems such as noise, safety concerns, etc. all detract from the apartment's resale value...

the only upside of a low floor is that your view will never get worse. buying on a high floor costs you a lot of $ when you have a view and then zoning changes and some monstrosity is built taking away your view...

We just bought on the first floor in the back of the building. So far we are more than happy, however, I doubt we would have bought in the front of the building because of the potential for street noise and people walking bye all the time. We have less noise even though there is some outside space at the back of the building. As for rodents, I'm guessing it really has to do with how clean your building is. If there are rodents on teh first floor, there are rodents on the other floors. Last I checked, rodents do not discriminate on the basis of the location of your apartment. If there is food to be had, they will find it.

Remember to beat-up the seller on the way in, because you are going to get beat-up on the way out: low-ball the bid, make seller cover your closing costs, get all kinds of contingencies, close when you want to close, etc.

Does anyone know what the difference in price between a first floor co-op and same unit on a higher floor ?

do not know exacted% but it is less. I have seen buildings with $850K high floor units, and the same unit on the first floor $650K.

First floor is always less desirable because of
1) Safety
2) View or lack of view
3) Noise

Does all of this apply to "parlor floor" apartments as well? I just saw a nice parlor floor apartment and liked the huge ceilings. Safety is definitely a concern as well. But most concerned about rodents and resale. Thanks.

If you like the unit and if the price is lower than same unit on higer floors, go for it. However, be aware that when it becomes time to sell,you may be in for a long haul.If there is a rodent problem on the first floor, their are rodents thruout the building. this is an issue of general building maintence. Good Luck

I signed a contract to buy a ground floor front unit of a new condo development in Chelsea. But after serious consideration, I rescinded within the allowable period. The only reason I considered it in the first place is the price - 20% below the units one floor up and way below market price in the area. But I'm glad I backed out. Apparently, I wasn't the only one. 3 more people rescinded before me on the same unit. The broker was obviously annoyed by it and just wanted to get rid of it fast. This gives you some idea how difficult it is to resell a first floor unit.

why are the maintance fees so low on first floor units, compared to the same size unit on higher floors?

Elevators

I lived in the first floor (fortunately it was a rental) for several years.

Noise: As several people have noted, noise levels ate considerably higher. The continuous random street sounds did not bother me much; I quickly got accustomed to the sounds of vehicles and passerby’s normal voices. Drunken 20-something males who found it necessary to “dis dat bitch” at 2AM were annoying but infrequent. (And lest someone think I am making a racial stereotype – these were mostly white guys; ah, the allure of hip-hop.)

The more frequent noise problem was tenants and guests entering and leaving building. People who would probably never be loud on their floor thought the lobby was an extension of the street. Late-night revelers would come crashing in, dropping keys, swearing, slamming mail-doors closed, etc. “Hey – Mabel – see you tomorrow!” shouted 5 feet from my door at 2AM as drunken boy escorts drunken girl into lobby, was a frequent problem.

I also found that a big problem was proximity to the basement. The basement of many buildings is dirty, damp, and connected to the outside by dozens of cracks, holes, gaps, air-vents, etc. The only thing a basement lacks is FOOD. That is where your apartment plays a role. Just about anything that lived outside could get into the basement. The fact that many pipes from the apartment went directly into basement meant that anything in the basement could get into your apartment via pipe-routing passages. Despite serious effort to plug these holes with expanding foam and other means (and spraying enough pesticide to kill a small suburban village), it was a continuous struggle. Keeping every food item in sealable plastic containers made me feel like Mel Gibson in the movie Conspiracy Theory.

Other than that, first-floor life was cool. No waiting for elevator. No walking up stairs when elevator was broken. No need to worry that my heels would make noise in the apartment below. Much lower a/c costs than at top floor.

Penny--Did you ever leave that apartment?

Just say no.

#23: Do you mean "did I move out"? Or do you mean "did I ever leave the confines of my apartment and see the outside world"?

If the former - yes, years ago.

If the second, except for evenings and nights I was rarely there.

Why?

Or should I take #24's advice and say "NO!" ?

Of course a first floor is not great, noise.

Do you think resale value for a 1st floor unit rear-facing is in issue in the west village as well?

For a while I had a rear-facing ground floor apt on Greenwich Ave (north side, below 13'th st). There was a court yard behind building. There was no noise issues, except when a building occupant chose invite guests to have a party in yard.

There was, back then, a BIG issue with crime. The ground floor apartments were the easiest to get into. There was also a bit of an issue with peeping-tom types, but appropriate use of opaque curtains can address that.

There was even a below-grade apartment below me, so the 'proximity to damp buggy basement' issues did not arise.

Go for it! But make sure your windows are lockable and kept locked.

rodents, noise

Yes, there are all those things mentioned such as noise, break-in issues, proximity to basement etc, but if you are willing to deal with these and pay 25% less and sell for that price difference in a few years, then it will be fine

its not worth it to live w/mice

If you think mice are bad, try living with a man!

Oh, that's a good one !!! You're right, sometimes I can't stand MYSELF.

Not all first floor apartments are the same for the record. We live on the first floor in the back of a building that sits on the upside of a hill. No street noise (the inner courtyard is very quiet), not bad light compared to the front b/c the rear space between bldgs is as wide as the street the bldg sits on, no problem with crime (the buildings are completely fenced in with very high fences); our windows are actually at least 15 feet from the ground outside due to the slope of the hill (that also makes our windows even with the 3rd floor apartments on the south/down hill building we face); and no problem with vermin, etc. as the super's apartment is below us and the basement of the bldg is spotless.

I agree that first floor apartments that are actually front of the bldg and street-level require a discount, but not all "first floor" apartments are the same.

How does living in a 1st floor apt differ from owning a house? Wouldnt you have all the safety/noise/pest issues with a house that you would have in an first floor apt?

Considering a 1st floor (technically 2nd floor, but the street is on a hill, so 2nd floor becomes "street level" where this apt is) apt in Queens. Its a quiet street, there is 24 hr doorman, and there are cameras covering the entire perimeter of the bldg.

I thought about most of the things mentioned above, but thought it should be OK, since we were also considering a house. Also checked the rest of the block... no gates, bars on windows, etc, so people apparently feel pretty safe (its in Forest Hills).

I live on the second floor and really love the convenience of the stairs and getting out the building in 10 secs. First floor would be great, but our basement and a few first floor apartment have reported ants from the garden.

As a rule first floor apartments are less safe (evidenced by the bars on the windows) and much nosier.

I get some people on this site may enjoy their first floor apartment but they sell at a discount to units in the rest of the building.

Definitely less desirable.

I would say a 100% discount...why would you want to pay to live in a first floor apartment..ugh

There are 3 factors that will bear on the quality of your investment in an apartment: (1) location in NYC, (2) quality of the building, (3) view & light. The the more you compromise on any one of these, the less desireable the property will be to future buyers and thus the more difficult to resell. How much to discount? A lot. I wouldn't touch a ground floor apartment unless the cost per square foot compared to all other apartments in the building and surrounding buildings was an absolute bargain basement steal. Since you are necessarily sacrificing any views and a lot of light, I would say the desireability of the building and location would have to be top-notch. Otherwise, keep looking. Even a 6th floor walk-up is more desireable (at least you get light and views--remember the 3 things above?) than a street level place.

I live in a ground floor apartment with private garden (400 sq foot) and my apartment is valued (by Douglas Elliman) 100K more than the same apartments in the same line. So, if you have a private garden, your apartment worth more, no less than!! Since I've a dog, I leave the door open to the garden all day and I 've never see a mice or a rat!! It all depends on how clean is the building and your apartment.

pepsimax25..never see a rat or a mouse..I think you need to buy eyeglasses. keeping your door open is amazing to me...it also shows how new yorkers justify every apartment they live in as being valuable beyond other apartments.

In Brownstones/townhouses in desirable neighborhoods the first and second floor are generally the most valuable units - often the first floor/garden unit has outdoor space/bbq area and its own entrance ip front and the second floor is not much up a drag in terms of stairs and often is slightly bigger w bay wondows etc...

brownstones/townhouses don't have elevators...of course the first and second floor is more valuable. who wants to climb 5 flights.

Here is an example of a nice ground floor apt with bk courtyard view in gramercy aera...I used to live in that building, it was a very prime location.

http://www.streeteasy.com/nyc/sale/94265-coop-145-east-15th-street-gramercy-park-new-york

Price History
07/10/2007 Listed in StreetEasy with Douglas Elliman at $679,000
07/26/2007 Price decreased to $649,000
09/11/2007 Price decreased to $619,000
09/24/2007 Price decreased to $599,000
10/17/2007 Price decreased to $569,000
01/10/2008 Listing entered contract

I looked at this apartment, right outside the front windows is the ramp for the garbage to be hauled out of the building. Plus there was a nick in the front window pane from a BB gun, guess that is a danger for any first floor apt. And on a busy street, on the corner of 3rd Avenue, with a lot of bars nearby. Seller had high hopes asking 679K for that apt.

yes the worst is when you have broken beer bottles outside the window - what did other units of the same size sell for in this building?

I bought a new construction condo approximately 2 years ago in West Harlem. My unit was a duplex with the upper floor at street level and the lower floor is considered the cellar (a finished basement). I would say that as with any home purchase you need to weigh the pro's and con's. I got a signficantly larger apartment and much nicer layout by buying on the first floor. I was initially considered about pests of all sorts- but honestly, because I keep my apartment spotless, I have virtually no issues. Other apartments in the building have complained about mice (but our maintenance person confided in me that those apartments are not very clean). I do occassionally notice an occassional centipede in the cellar, but no other pests.

As for light- my neighborhood is filled with 5 and 6 story buildings- so no towers blocking the light- and my below grade windows/patio in the cellar area make it feel very light and airy. The ground floor windows are obviously exposed to everyone- but I use a shoji screen (sliding door) style window treatment to allow light in, but keeps privacy.

Noise- well I do have more noise from outside than those on higher floors- but it's typically not signficantly worse than those on higher floors (the windows are decent with sound isolation). I do hear a lot more hallway noise than others, but I will be investigating buying a better entry door for sound insulation (my condo board is not too particular). As to one person's comment about 1A and getting people buzzing for the super- it does happen to mine too- but not with great frequency.

I got approximately 35% more space than an apartment priced the same on the 5th floor. I would have preferred a garden view to a street view (that apartment was sold already)- but other than that, I don't regret my purchase.

What about all the gun shots? Do those keep you up at night?

Fishhead: that was just nasty and not funny.

I'm just saying what everyone was thinking

Fishhead, you are wrong again. I for one wasn't thinking anything like what you wrote. What you wrote reflects only your own sad stereotypes. Reflect on this and see if you think it might just be right to apologize to semerun and everyone else you offended and we'll all move on.

Actually, I didn't find Fishhead's post insulting. When I first told my parents that I was looking to buy a condo in West Harlem, they thought I was nuts. My dad literally ran for his life when he worked up in my neighborhood in the early 1970's. They trust my judgement, but they still had a difficult time understanding my decision. My lawyer had the very same reaction. There is still a presence of drug dealers in the vicinity, but there has been a signficant decrease in the 2 years I have been here- and their presense is dwindling fast. I took a risk that the neighborhood was changing, and it has and continues to improve. I feel that I made the right decision- and in the last several months the doubters are starting to agree with me.

As for price improvements- see the article in Forbes.. http://www.forbes.com/2008/01/17/homes-profit-lucrative-forbeslife-cx_mw_0117realestate_slide_3.html?thisSpeed=15000. I think that the article is flawed, but interesting still (they didn't account for the cost of capital improvements).

I've always thought when the market drops areas like bed stuy, harlem, etc. will drop faster and deeper. Semerun...you sound happy in your apt. which is what counts the most.

Julia, it already has in a number of them.

kylewest, have you reflected on who owes who the apology?

I haven't. I think the comment about bullets is still nasty and based on stereotypes from another era. The NYPD, Harlem community groups, demographics, and time have done a lot to alter the reality of life in the area and the levels of violent crime. In 2007 there were 10 homicides for the entire precinct covering the area and 0 for the adjacent precinct to the west. This is a reduction of over 71.4% over the last 15 years. Other violent crimes in the precinct covering Harlem are similarly at historic lows. Harlem has experienced essentially the same drop in overall crime as the rest of the city. Yes, fringes (and Harlem is still a fringe neighborhood in the RE world) do get hit first and more in a downturn, and homeowners will have to contend with that. "Bullets flying," however, will not be the reason and jibes to that effect strike me as unconstructive and tinged with something ugly. My opinion. Nothing more. FWIW.

Yes, these all things define above true Noise ! Lobby noise , upstairs ...There are so many drawback to buy first floor apartment.If you getting with 25% discount i suggest don't buy because comfort is more important and relaxation must ..You can't satisfy on noisy place.