Toren

nyc10022: about 10 weeks ago

Right, I said 4-5% looks to be the floor differential for a couple of floors....

You can also look at this on streeteasy...

108 active sales listings: $760 per ft² (avg)
15 previous sales listings: $792 per ft² (avg)

ap307: about 10 weeks ago

Could me, but it's more likely to be gradual increase in prices as they sell more apartments. Plus 10% is too high to be floor differential (no views are improved with higher floors).

nyc10022: about 10 weeks ago

Gocha. Did you find out the other details that would affect price? As in closing cost coverage, freebies, etc?

Would be interesting to have some comparables...

When did you sign your contract? And do you want to give anything more specific around price level/size?

I'm noticing that 1403 sold for 4% more than 1003, 1804 for 3% more than 1604, 2204 5% more than 1804, and 3304 12% more than that... 1901 went for 5% more than 1501.

So 4-5% could be the floor differential...

ap307: about 10 weeks ago

My mistake, should have said it entered contract this week.

nyc10022: about 10 weeks ago

It went into contract and closed in the same week? Is it me, or is that a record?

ap307: about 10 weeks ago

This week.

nyc10022: about 10 weeks ago

When did it go into contract?

ap307: about 10 weeks ago

Say what you want, but an apartment 3 floors above mine closed for 10% higher than I paid (and there are no views from my line to be gained from being higher up)...

Junkman: about 10 weeks ago

nyc10022, look at Be@Schermerhorn and look at current prices and I guarantee that they will have major drop in prices, that is if they don't go rental beforehand.

Clermont on Myrtle just went from condo to rental. I hate to agree with EddieWilson but Downtown Brooklyn will have a major glut. Just hope Toren keeps bucking the trend.

http://www.brownstoner.com/brownstoner/archives/2008/09/zoinks_the_cler.php

nyc10022: about 10 weeks ago

> According to the report, there hasn't been a market crash - at least not yet.

Well, Manhattan is now down 6-7% in Q3, and that doesn't even include the Wall Street panic period.

Very curious to see what Brooklyn numbers are for the period, as they started descending a quarter before Manhattan... and MUCH more inventory...

Junkman: about 10 weeks ago

All of us who bought early are happy since our purchase has increased in value. For example, I purchased apt.1005 four months ago for $506,000 and now 1105 is now being priced for $577,000. Same exact apartment one floor higher for $71,000 more. There are other lines that have increased also. Prior increases have sold so we can assume that management knows what they are doing when increasing prices at such a fantastic rate. I'd be shocked if anyone who has purchased has any regrets unless they are adverse to price appreciation. Fact is, I'm getting use to new amendments (6 to date) and expect to see more on a monthly basis. lol

now1225: about 10 weeks ago

Are there any happy buyers? It looks like really nice.

BKindaHouse: about 3 months ago

http://ny.metro.us/metro/local/article/Apple_store_crowds_irk_some_neighbors/13387.html

Check it out. Does Toren really want Apple?

Special_K: about 3 months ago

80s man, good point on both the lag and worry free nature of new condos.

80sMan: about 3 months ago

Special_K, there can easily be a 3-month lag between contract signed and sale reported closed for resales. For new construction this can be up to 2 years. So I believe you are correct, much of the housing prices we're seeing are what people believed to be fair prices in 2007. People are also looking to buy brand new because of the general belief that new apartments are relatively worry free in comparison to older ones although a check of the topics on tis board proves that is not always the case.

Special_K: about 3 months ago

"what's the deal? do you think people can't read the report themselves? avg prices for q2 were up over q1. median prices were down by a fraction of a percent. let's call it flat. where is the market crash? "

According to the report, there hasn't been a market crash - at least not yet. I'm talking brooklyn overall now and I only look y-o-y, sequential is just not that useful given big seasonality changes between 1Q and 2Q. It's clear, average price UP 2.4%, median DOWN 1.9%. BrooklynL, like you said, let's call it flat. But despite all the EW bashing here, he has a point - sales volume down 44%.

Why does that predicate a fall in price? Because it nearly always does. This is sort of basic but it seems like some people don't quite get it:
1) sales volume drops as marginal buyers fall out of the market (for the host of reasons people have said all over this board)
2) inventory (measured in months to sell and not necessarily absolute levels) builds
3) buyers have more selection, and with negative press, sit and wait
4) so volume declines further, and the circle continues. What reverses this funk is price decline until enough buyers come back in.

A few observations on the data.
1) In down volume, its my belief that better quality apartments sell and those of marginal/bad quality don't as well. So that creates a short term upward price bias as volume falls off.
2) Where did the 2.4% increase in average price overall come from? Condos. Every other type of real estate from coops to luxury to family fell in average price.
3) And where did most of the yoy condo price increases came from? New developments. 51% of condo sales were new developments vs. 32% last year and new development prices were up 27% on per sq ft basis.
4) So why is new development up so much? That's open for debate but I think most new developments are made with better finishes, more amenities, so some of that price "increase" is simply accounting for that. Also, new construction in the city could have been signed 12 months ago, in a very different market so again, some of that price increase is simply transactions at the peak filtering through the system now.

Junkman: about 3 months ago

Junkman, are you serious? Yea, good point.

junkman_r_u_serious: about 3 months ago

so....how about that Toren....

BrooklynLove: about 3 months ago

eddie - what's the deal? do you think people can't read the report themselves? avg prices for q2 were up over q1. median prices were down by a fraction of a percent. let's call it flat. where is the market crash? continuing to deny the facts is just hurting any scintilla of credibility you're still clinging to. let's see where the rising inventory and dropping sales volume lead over the next few quarters, but right now the data is not helping you. you should also consider this point - a unit selling at oro at 15% off listing price is still at a price way above current bk median and avg levels.

LICComment: about 3 months ago

First off, I don't have any other aliases. There are just lots of people who see that Eddie Wilson is a douche. He also seems paranoid delusional, thinking that all the posters criticizing him are really me.
Second - way to rudely attack and insult more and more people Eddie. Did dontusesplenda say anything that warranted your rude attitude, insults (calling him/her a nut, saying they can't read)? The answer is no, that you are just a total jackass. You probably have no friends and troll this board just to get some attention. Do you not mind that everyone just wants to you go away? And not because of your real estate view, but because you are a disrespectful, rude, annoying troll?

EddieWilson: about 3 months ago

Suicide isn't something to joke about.

When the big losses set in, we're going to have to actually worry about that from some board participants...

GlenT: about 3 months ago

I used to work on one of NYC's suicide hotlines as a volunteer. We had regular callers who we kept databases on so we could best deal with them one time to the next. Eddie reminds me ...

EddieWilson: about 3 months ago

Wow, I AGREED with you, and you freaked out.

But, hell, if you can't take that, you're going to have a lousy time on this board...

EddieWilson: about 3 months ago

Are you a nutjob?

> Thanks for attacking me.

I didn't attach you, I suggested that if you want RE posts, maybe you should make some."
"But maybe you should take your own advice, and end the non-RE talk.... its ok to leave it be."

If you think thats an attack, you are nutty.

> btw, you did say that people making bullish comments is a challenge:

You are not just nutty, you don't understand English very well.
You quoted me but apparently didn't read it:

"Agreed. The challenge is, you have former bulls who will do anything to cover up, brush aside, or rationalize "minor details" like 43% sales declines."

There is no challenge from bullish statements, they're all good. The challenge AS I NOTED is the "cover up" or "rationaliz[ation]" of actual facts.

Seriously, you've been here 10 minutes and we've gotten only 10 complaints from you.

dontusesplenda: about 3 months ago

Thanks for attacking me.

btw, you did say that people making bullish comments is a challenge:

EddieWilson
14 minutes ago
ignore this person
report abuse > It would be helpful if people would answer real real estate questions. As an occasional reader, I
> find these discussions unhelpful.

Agreed. The challenge is, you have former bulls who will do anything to cover up, brush aside, or rationalize "minor details" like 43% sales declines.

Goodnight.

EddieWilson: about 3 months ago

> I'm not sure why someone making a bullish comment is a challenge.

Its not... I never said otherwise.

> Say your peace, they say theirs, but saying it more than once doesn't make the position more right,
> on either side

I don't disagree. But going for personal insults certainly doesn't either, and is more likely used to cover up a lack of facts/evidence/logic.

> But instead of the repeats, moving on to some other real estate discussion of
> interest might be the best use of space.

Again, I don't disagree...

But maybe you should take your own advice, and end the non-RE talk.... its ok to leave it be.

If you want RE posts, try posting some of your own. It works.

dontusesplenda: about 3 months ago

I'm not sure why someone making a bullish comment is a challenge.

Say your peace, they say theirs, but saying it more than once doesn't make the position more right, on either side - yours or the bulls. But instead of the repeats, moving on to some other real estate discussion of interest might be the best use of space. Of course, silence after you've exhausted your topics is also ok.

That's just what I think.

EddieWilsonIsADouche: about 3 months ago

Even worse, you have idiotic douche bags (or Eddie, for short) who ignores things like sales prices going up, price per square foot going up, and other facts just so he can go around screaming the sky is falling all day.

EddieWilson: about 3 months ago

> It would be helpful if people would answer real real estate questions. As an occasional reader, I
> find these discussions unhelpful.

Agreed. The challenge is, you have former bulls who will do anything to cover up, brush aside, or rationalize "minor details" like 43% sales declines.

EddieWilsonIsADouche: about 3 months ago

LOL.

When someone points out Eddie's mistakes, he conveniently puts them on his "ignore" list so he won't have to answer them.

EddieWilson: about 3 months ago

A little later to the party, ap... I already ignored the trolls.

It is ironic that the biggest complainers are the ones who follow me around replying to my posts.
If you don't want to read it, then don't. Ignore it. And definitely don't respond.

But the bitter former bulls seem to have nothing better to do...

dontusesplenda: about 3 months ago

It would be helpful if people would answer real real estate questions. As an occasional reader, I find these discussions unhelpful.

ap307: about 3 months ago

Guys, there's really no sense in having a reasoned argument with EW:

- he conveniently ignores facts that are contrary to his views, and stresses those that support his views to an obnoxious extent

- he must always have the last word, and will often post twice at the end of a thread for (pointless) emphasis

- everyone who take a positive view of real estate in virtually any building or location in Manhattan is a broker / shill (he must have broker / shill on some sort of speed-dial)

No point in responding to his posts directly. Maybe if we just ignore him he'll go away. There are plenty of other posters on this board who do a far more credible (and less annoying) job of taking the side of doom & gloom.

EddieWilson: about 3 months ago

Sorry guys, I've got the geniuses on ignore... LICC will have to create yet another alias to annoy me...

EddieWilsonIsADouche: about 3 months ago

Meh, it doesn't matter if you think I'm LIC or not.

I don't dislike EddieWilson. I don't know him from Adam, but it's pretty clear from his posts that he's a douche of epic proportions.

Anyway, I can't stand LIC. Really, what's the appeal?

ootin: about 3 months ago

EddieWilsonIsADouch, I think you can admit your are LICComment, it is pretty obvious. Don't worry tho, it doesn't subtract from your dislike of EddieWilson.

ootin: about 3 months ago

also

we've now figured out EddieWilson's motivation

> oh, FORTY FOUR PERCENT decline, so people aren't buying. What is the news then?

That we have the worst inventory problem we've had in years. And that, well, folks aren't buying. Apparently thats news to a lot of folks on this thread.

...

seems EddieWilson's sole reason for being here is just to tell those bad bulls and the ignorant people (who should go to Urbandigs instead of wasting time here) that no one is buying.

sole motivation is just to let everyone who is bullish (but still not buying, according to his logic) know that there is a lot of inventory and no buying going on.

Thanks for contributing

EddieWilsonIsADouche: about 3 months ago

Here's another one, Eddie, that I'm sure you won't be able to understand.

Median sales price for the condo market was 8.1% HIGHER than the median sales price of the prior year quarter, and Brooklyn condos had a price per square foot increase of 16.4%.

Seriously, where's the decline?

ootin: about 3 months ago

I think we found the proof that ESueCho was short on:

EddieWilson
2 minutes ago
ignore this person
report abuse ... you don't know what you're talking about.

Who else besides stevejhx repeatedly says "you don't know what you are talking about"?

EddieWilsonIsADouche: about 3 months ago

From the report:

"North Brooklyn and Northwest "Brownstone" Brooklyn experienced INCREASES in prices over the prior year quarter...the median sales price of a North Brooklyn property was UP 9% over the prior year quarter and Northwest Brooklyn had a median sales price UP 7.5% over the same period."

OH MY LORD will someone get this dumbass a reading tutor...